[erlang-questions] OT: Please highlight me about JAVA C++ as high level languages just like erlang.

Angel <>
Sat Jan 23 04:09:42 CET 2010


Thanks Michael, and all people.

Definitely (just for helping newbies choose where to spent their time)

My vision about computer languages is something along this:


- Wassup men!! ¿i have some spare time You know? , Im considering learning to  
program computers!! Now boy, come on!! tell me whats best language!!!

- Sure!! Leptons is your color!!! that kinda funny lang men!! the best!!!! 
trust me is damn fast, bare metal ¡¡you know!! zwwwipppp!!

- So fast!! i can't wait

- Sure dude, all people know leptons!! They do!!! I almost spent last two 
months hacking a kind of thing i call STRING!! is cool, millions and millions 
of leptons, muons and mesons you know!

-- Gauu i see, im impressed!!

- Sure!! da thing its cool, so i managed later to make still more milliion of 
them and make atoms!! yeahh i tell you, those BIG atoms allowed me to to logic 
gates!!! 

- Macho macho men !!

-Wait!!! its not the end, those funky gates... store bits!! and some of them 
bytes...

-IM DISMAYED!!

-Take easy men,!!! you'll learn this soon!! so i managed again to make 
caracters to make words!!! trust me, i dont cheat!! and  ITS BLAZING FAST!!!

 
- You are the ONE guy!! i almost go wrong on trying to learng BRICKS..

- BRICKS!! Are you mad!! this is for academic freaks nobody else will even 
think using it!! Hear me, it  is no way men HOUSES!!! what's that? almost all 
you can make with this are HOUSES terrible boring.

- Yeahh, full of shit!!! i saw they have also electric outlets!!...

-Yeahh men you told it ¡¡SHITTT!! 

¡¡¡OUTLETS!!! 

what is cool....

... is to make the electrons yourself!!




/Angel

Sorry for my english!!











On Viernes, 22 de Enero de 2010 09:02:15 usted escribió:
> I'd always assumed that the "level" in "high level language" was a
> measure of abstraction in some software concept domain, not of
> performance or suitability for some particular purpose.  If C is good
> when a 16-bit microcontroller is the target, it's because C can get you
> quite close to the bare metal, which is how you typically extract the
> use-value of such a part.  The *costs* and *risks* of being so close to
> bare metal should go without saying -- "close", in this case, means
> "almost down to".  (Wasn't it Dennis Ritchie himself who quipped "C
> combines the flexibility of assembly language with the power of assembly
> language"?)
> 
> Admittedly, this picture is complicated by the metaprogramming aspects of
> languages.  Take BLISS -- it was a bare-metal programming language with
> a Turing-complete macro facility.  C++ can also be used near bare metal
> (indeed, when I taught a course in it I was amused to see how many of my
> students were embedded systems developers) but its template syntax
> rivals or exceeds the power of BLISS macros and continues to reach
> higher.
> 
> However, one might consider metaprogrammability simply yet another of
> several possible domains for a language -- the reflexive one.  I'd say
> that Erlang and the LISPs, Smalltalk and some others (even Forth, IIRC)
> are higher level than C++ in metaprogrammability, even if C++ is still
> relatively high in that way.  Yes, the Boost library provides a kind of
> lambda for C++, but only in a way that's so clunky as to clearly not be
> a "part of" C++; more an argument for Greenspun's Tenth Law if
> anything.
> 
> -michael
> 
> On 1/22/2010, "Richard O'Keefe" <> wrote:
> >On Jan 22, 2010, at 4:26 AM, Angel wrote:
> >> So im really displeased to see everyone still closely tied to the
> >> "old classic
> >> high level definition". its dificult to place erlang over a plethora
> >> of not
> >> certainly better languages if all of them are considered equal.
> >
> >It doesn't matter what we call them, it's STILL difficult to place
> >Erlang amongst a vast range of other languages.
> >
> >Erlang isn't even close to APL2 as a notation for matrix calculations.
> >APL2 isn't even close to Erlang as a notation for concurrency.
> >Neither of them can hold a candle to C as a notation for programming
> >16-bit microcontrollers, although one could imagine a derivative of
> >Concurrent Pascal that would have been even better.
> >
> >There simply isn't a linear ordering.
> >The most you can say is that one language is higher level than
> >another for certain things.
> >
> >Mind you, it is clearly possible to classify some languages as bad
> >for any practical purpose.  Intercal, Brainf*ck, and the whitespace
> >language spring to mind.
> >
> >I recently solved a problem by writing
> >  - a data file
> >  - an AWK program to compile that into C
> >and running the C program.  Doing the whole thing in C would have
> >been slow, because it would have been doing at run time decisions
> >that were better made at meta-compilation time.
> >
> >This kind of thing blurs the "level of a language" idea even
> >further.  C on its own: bad.  AWK on its own: worse.  AWK+C: excellent.
> >
> >I think it gets us further to say "Language X does this, language Y
> >does that, for problem P, what language X does helped me get my
> >program working quicker".  The Grand Convergence (where Java and C#
> >and Eiffel and others are borrowing ideas from the functional world
> >and from each other) means that "language Y is no good because it
> >doesn't have feature F" is a permanent truth only for dead languages.
> >
> >
> >________________________________________________________________
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> >erlang-questions (at) erlang.org
> 


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