[erlang-questions] [ANN] Positive version 13.3.7

Fri Mar 25 23:05:10 CET 2016

I'm definitely considering Elixir for the final project, partially due to
the language being a bit less foreign to developers in more mainstream
languages. I decided to start with Erlang first due to the better OTP
resources and once I feel comfortable I'll do a more thorough look at
Elixir to determine which I want to do the project in.   I'm still not
totally confident that even Elixir would make it easier to justify the
business risk to the company, but for now I'm treating it as a personal
project and I'll deal with that once I'm able to at least successfully show
a product that can solve our business problems better than our current
systems.

And I 1000% agree with the idea of hiring developers based on skills,
creativeness and passion instead of basing it on language (though that's
mostly because of my personal experience of being quickly dismissed just
because the majority of my professional experience is in .Net).  However,
it's a lot easier to hire based on those when you have a good financial
backing to risk developers that end up not being able to be onboarded to
foreign systems as easily.  Hopefully we get that way sooner rather than
later, but until then :)

On Fri, Mar 25, 2016 at 5:46 PM, Lee Sylvester <lee.sylvester@REDACTED>
wrote:

> @Matthew, I'm giving a talk in Wellington in August at ScaleConf on moving
> from Ruby to Elixir.  Yes, the underlying fundamentals are different, and
> OTP is different, but moving from Ruby to Elixir is a much gentler curve
> than from JS to Erlang.  Maybe you could consider hiring Ruby devs?
>
> I recently read an article (I forget where) about a company who code with
> Erlang who don't hire Erlang devs.  They hire creative devs with a passion
> for learning, and simply ask them to learn Erlang.
>
> It's a thought.
>
> On Sat, Mar 26, 2016 at 10:42 AM, Matthew Shapiro <me@REDACTED> wrote:
>
>> Unfortunately, that's way too true :(.
>>
>> My real project I"m learning Erlang for is for an video ingestion server,
>> because I believe I can create something that works better than what we are
>> currently using at our company, and Erlang and the Beam VM hits every
>> checkbox so much better than every other language and runtime out there.
>>
>> Unfortunately, I am also keenly aware I will never bring this into
>> production at my company since we are a small startup (5 people total, 2
>> engineers) in Orlando, FL which has zero Erlang developers positions around
>> (and probably thus a small pool of potential developers).  It's so
>> fundamentally different (both on a framework and language level) from most
>> other languages in this area that onboarding a new developer onto Erlang in
>> sufficient amount of time is not going to be trivial or cheap, and anything
>> I put into production needs to be able to be maintained by others that are
>> not me.  So while Erlang checks all the boxes I still can't say it's the
>> right tool due to that :-/.
>>
>> Of course, Javascript 100% is not the right tool for this job in every
>> way, shape, or form (I actually had a Javascript developer in my coworking
>> space ask why I wasn't doing it in Node.js, sigh).
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 25, 2016 at 3:10 PM, Loïc Hoguin <essen@REDACTED> wrote:
>>
>>> There is no such thing as the right tool for the job.
>>>
>>> There's the tools that work *for you*, and those that don't.
>>>
>>> JS is working for a lot of people. Erlang for a lot less.
>>>
>>> In the real world, all that matters is that the tool is *good enough*
>>> and that you are *familiar* with it.
>>>
>>> Any combination where one of these is false leads to disaster. People
>>> who never used Erlang before will not magically come up with a good
>>> implementation (they can, but it takes a lot more time). Similarly, people
>>> who are trying to use Erlang for what it's not good at will also fail, or
>>> struggle to make it work.
>>>
>>> When choosing a tool for a project, the question should really be "Which
>>> tool do I know or can quickly get comfortable with, and can help me produce
>>> a working solution?"
>>>
>>> The answer to that question is different for everyone.
>>>
>>> On 03/25/2016 07:47 PM, Lee Sylvester wrote:
>>>
>>>> JS is a major player due to laziness.  I'm sorry, but a JS runtime on
>>>> the server is never a good idea.  I don't use Elixir / Erlang for every
>>>> project, I use the right tool for the job, whether I've used it before
>>>> or not.  It just so happens that Elixir / Erlang is often the right
>>>> tool.
>>>>
>>>> I'm sure it's the same for you guys?  The fact that Erlangs language is
>>>> poetry and Elixir's eco-system is bliss means nothing :-P
>>>>
>>>> On Mar 26, 2016 7:21 AM, "Michael Truog" <mjtruog@REDACTED
>>>> <mailto:mjtruog@REDACTED>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>     On 03/25/2016 10:55 AM, Loïc Hoguin wrote:
>>>>
>>>>         On 03/25/2016 02:20 AM, zxq9 wrote:
>>>>
>>>>             EVERYONE! STOP EVERYTHING! SATIRE IS NOW "TOXIC"!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>         Shame is temporary. A good story is for life.
>>>>
>>>>         What happened is a story for the ages. And a pretty good one.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     I agree.  This is a positive contribution and no one can deny that.
>>>>     _______________________________________________
>>>>     erlang-questions mailing list
>>>>     erlang-questions@REDACTED <mailto:erlang-questions@REDACTED>
>>>>     http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions
>>>>
>>>>
>>> --
>>> Loïc Hoguin
>>> http://ninenines.eu
>>> Author of The Erlanger Playbook,
>>> A book about software development using Erlang
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> erlang-questions mailing list
>>> erlang-questions@REDACTED
>>> http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions
>>>
>>
>>
>
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