[erlang-questions] Beginner trying to figure out idiomatic OTP architecture

Matthew Shapiro <>
Thu Mar 24 03:02:46 CET 2016


Thank you very much,  Ranch, gproc, and syn seem like perfect frameworks to
handle those portions of it and simplifies a lot of things (though I need
to do some research to figure out the difference between gproc and syn).
So that solves those issues, well although it looks like I will have to
jump through some hoops to get Ranch working on Windows.

In regards to the channel per process vs not, I think my mind went to that
idea due to knowing that in normal IRC servers channels have other
particular aspects to them (such as titles and modes, etc...) and I guess
those aspects made my mental model lean towards channels as individual
processes (even though I admit those features aren't part of my
requirements since this is just to get my feet wet).

While I haven't gotten to clustering stuff in Erlang yet, my idea was to
guarantee that if a netsplit occurs you can communicate with user in your
channels that are connected to the same node as you are in.  I don't know
yet if that changes the architecture at all but in my mind I'm not sure if
it does (channel manager/channel processes would just relay the messages to
the other nodes).

Anyways, some pretty interesting and enlightining things to think about


On Wed, Mar 23, 2016 at 10:19 AM, Jesper Louis Andersen <
> wrote:

>
> On Tue, Mar 22, 2016 at 4:06 AM, Matthew Shapiro <> wrote:
>
>> I am now at the point where I want to test some of this knowledge out,
>> and I thought a good idea was to create a (basic) IRC server (as I've
>> written them in the past in other languages, and it seemed like a good use
>> case for Erlang).
>
>
> Here is how I would do it:
>
> * There is no reason to run your own acceptor pool. Every client
> connecting runs behind the `ranch` acceptor pool.
>
> * The thing that happens concurrently in an IRC server are the connecting
> clients. There is relatively little need for a channel to act on behalf of
> itself, so one may look at a solution where a channel is just a list of
> members, handled by a general manager of channel lists in ETS. Posting a
> message to a channel is simply looking up interested parties, and sending
> the message to all of them. OTOH, having a process per channel could be
> helpful in order to proxy messages via the channel process: send to the
> chan process, and have it forward to the recipients. Which is best depends
> is not a priori clear to me, but when I did this years ago, I managed to do
> this without channel processes.
>
> * Consider managing the registry of Pids through either the `gproc` or the
> `syn` frameworks. This avoids you having to redo most of the nasty parts of
> registry and you can avoid the problems of using atoms only as in the local
> registry.
>
> * If you want your server to run as a cluster, you will have to think
> about the problem of a netsplit inside the cluster and what guarantees you
> want to have.
>
> This leaves your supervisor tree in one of two forms: Either the top-level
> supervisor runs a single channel manager process worker, or it runs a
> simple_one_for_one pool of channels together with a manager for
> creating/removing channels, if you deem it necessary to keep a process
> tracking each channel.
>
> In general, I would avoid solutions where you "hand off" state between
> processes as if they were sitting in a pipeline. It is often better to make
> the process itself run as an independent system. Joe said "An Erlang web
> server runs 2 million webservers, each serving one request." In this case,
> you could argue you want to run a couple thousand IRC servers, each serving
> one channel, and a couple thousand connection proxies, each serving one TCP
> connection, connecting to multiple such channels. A connection proxy then
> has the task of transforming the outside IRC protocol into nice symbolic
> Erlang terms band and forth. And the Channel servers are tasked with
> handling pub/sub between the processes, as well as ownership management of
> the channels in question.
>
> The trick is to get events/messages to flow between the connection
> processes such that the emergent behavior of a wild IRCd suddenly appears :)
>
> --
> J.
>
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