[erlang-questions] Two beautiful programs - or web programming made easy

Jerome Martin <>
Sat Feb 12 13:28:31 CET 2011


If only the browser could adopt for good a CONNECT-based handshake and
enable it by default, the world would be a better place to deploy web UIs
:-)

Because that remains the biggest issue for now, until I see this happening,
all that beauty might be lost :-(

On Sat, Feb 12, 2011 at 1:23 PM, Joe Armstrong <> wrote:

> On Sat, Feb 12, 2011 at 1:15 PM, Ulf Wiger
> <>wrote:
>
> >
> > Well, I read those links not as an indictment of websockets per se, but
> of
> > the UPGRADE-based handshake. I think Joe is definitely on to something
> here,
> > and this sort of setup fits Erlang beautifully.
> >
> > Essentially, Joe may have found a way to dust off his ex11 idea[1], in a
> > context where it is much more likely to succeed. ;-)
> >
> > (But please, Joe, leave out the !! this time - one revolution at a time.)
> >
>
> !! would be evil in this context. As soon as you get outside erlang !! is
> bad.
> ! is good because it creates no dependencies, the message either gets there
> or
> it does not. Code that can deal with this uncertainty will be good, other
> code is
> not.
>
> It's actually pretty awe-inspiring to say
>
> Pid ! button("click me") and see a button just appear in the browser
>
> Great fun.
>
> The great thing is that we can now abstract the interface
>
> button("text") means return a thing that when evaluated makes a button
> this code return Javascript, but it could equally well return xul, or html,
> or llvm assembler
> it doesn't matter - as long as the eval end knows how to eval it. So the
> top
> level
> code can be written entirely without knowledge of what's going on under the
> covers
>
> /Joe
>
>
> /Joe
>
>
>
> >
> > BR,
> > Ulf W
> >
> > [1]  http://ftp.sunet.se/pub/lang/erlang/workshop/2004/ex11.pdf
> >
> > On 12 Feb 2011, at 12:46, Masklinn wrote:
> >
> > > On 2011-02-12, at 12:33 , Joe Armstrong wrote:
> > >>
> > >> You'll need something like Google chrome to run them.
> > > Warning: the status of the (currently broken [0]) WebSockets is unsure:
> > Firefox and Opera already dropped it, it is unknown whether Chrome and
> > Safari will keep it enabled by default. Chrome-wise, they've kept it for
> now
> > but they plan on disabling it as soon as they hear of an exploit in the
> > wild[1]
> > >
> > > Also, it's going to be a complete and utter pain to debug: even the
> more
> > modern JS debuggers of Firefox (via Firebug) and Webkit have insane
> amounts
> > of trouble finding and debugging dynamically evaluated code.
> > >
> > > [0] http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/hybi/current/msg04744.html
> > > [1] http://codereview.chromium.org/5643005/
> > > ________________________________________________________________
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> > > See http://www.erlang.org/faq.html
> > > To unsubscribe; mailto:
> > >
> >
> > Ulf Wiger, CTO, Erlang Solutions, Ltd.
> > http://erlang-solutions.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
>



-- 
Jérôme Martin


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